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	<title>Comments on: Why Is Tracking202 Free &#8211; My Mistakes &#8211; Launching Under Fire</title>
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	<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/</link>
	<description>I'm going to create an online web 2.0 community, which will be oriented towards Google/Yahoo for a buy out in several years for millions, then invest the money into steady real estate investments.  From testimonials &#38; personal experiences, we know what is possible, is possible for us.</description>
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		<title>By: Rafe</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8975</link>
		<dc:creator>Rafe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 22:02:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8975</guid>
		<description>thanks for the info on the scripts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks for the info on the scripts.</p>
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		<title>By: Wes Mahler</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8143</link>
		<dc:creator>Wes Mahler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 11:43:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thanks deStone apologize for the delay response, I&#039;ve taken yours and everyones suggestions and we have a self-hosted version in the works as we speak, it should be done by the end of this month.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks deStone apologize for the delay response, I&#8217;ve taken yours and everyones suggestions and we have a self-hosted version in the works as we speak, it should be done by the end of this month.</p>
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		<title>By: deStone</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8098</link>
		<dc:creator>deStone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:14:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8098</guid>
		<description>Wes,

By encrypting the data on your db side, youre keeping malicious users from benefiting by grabbing that data.  You&#039;ve got a massive list of keywords in your possession that belongs to the users that inputed that into your system.  You also know what keywords are successful and which ones are not.  You shouldn&#039;t be able to see them, nor should some script kiddy running some sql injection scripts, only the user.

I think you&#039;ve got a really good model here -- there are just way to many flaws to justify me dumping my keyword lists into it.  I &quot;trust&quot; you -- its your system I do not trust.  Even if you gave this product away for people to use on their own servers, you should have encryption built into it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes,</p>
<p>By encrypting the data on your db side, youre keeping malicious users from benefiting by grabbing that data.  You&#8217;ve got a massive list of keywords in your possession that belongs to the users that inputed that into your system.  You also know what keywords are successful and which ones are not.  You shouldn&#8217;t be able to see them, nor should some script kiddy running some sql injection scripts, only the user.</p>
<p>I think you&#8217;ve got a really good model here &#8212; there are just way to many flaws to justify me dumping my keyword lists into it.  I &#8220;trust&#8221; you &#8212; its your system I do not trust.  Even if you gave this product away for people to use on their own servers, you should have encryption built into it.</p>
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		<title>By: Wes Mahler</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8090</link>
		<dc:creator>Wes Mahler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8090</guid>
		<description>@ Tim,

Yeah if we did it, it would be closed sourced most likely, it could be potentially open source but I think we would try to limit it.  It&#039;s kinda a tough call we have some trade secrets with how we filter out data, and the formula would be seen by everyone, so its sorta like how coca cola builds their cola, and don&#039;t tell anyone the recipe they use, we have a trade secret on filtering process which I developed and the whole system is based on that, and if it was visible it be a huge loss to us.

@ Dr Nick

I assume this only works if you have a landing page type setup correct? Where the user punches in a javascript key to encrypt it? I see what you mean, but wouldn&#039;t users still feel at the end of the day that I we could potentially crack it if we really wanted to?  Or would you argue not so much?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Tim,</p>
<p>Yeah if we did it, it would be closed sourced most likely, it could be potentially open source but I think we would try to limit it.  It&#8217;s kinda a tough call we have some trade secrets with how we filter out data, and the formula would be seen by everyone, so its sorta like how coca cola builds their cola, and don&#8217;t tell anyone the recipe they use, we have a trade secret on filtering process which I developed and the whole system is based on that, and if it was visible it be a huge loss to us.</p>
<p>@ Dr Nick</p>
<p>I assume this only works if you have a landing page type setup correct? Where the user punches in a javascript key to encrypt it? I see what you mean, but wouldn&#8217;t users still feel at the end of the day that I we could potentially crack it if we really wanted to?  Or would you argue not so much?</p>
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		<title>By: Dr Nick</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8087</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 02:07:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8087</guid>
		<description>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-key_cryptography

Basically, you need to implement/copy two javascript functions. The user gives you a public key, that you apply to encrypt any keyword or textual data in your tracking script that the user places on their pages. The user can verify that you are not passing on any additional information to your servers by looking at your js code.

Your second javascript function requires a private key that is entered by the user and stored client-side (i.e. a cookie) -- something that is never passed to your server. When you display data, before you output any keywords or text, you call the decrypt function with the user&#039;s private key.

e.g. &quot;document.write(decrypt(&#039;kjfvclaylsery&#039;,$cookie_private_key));&quot;

Your database can number-crunch just as it did before -- it&#039;s only on the HTML output that you need to add the  decrypt javascript functions too. It shouldn&#039;t even take long to implement.

If you need more clarification, feel free to send me an email on this (email in comment form).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-key_cryptography" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-key_cryptography</a></p>
<p>Basically, you need to implement/copy two javascript functions. The user gives you a public key, that you apply to encrypt any keyword or textual data in your tracking script that the user places on their pages. The user can verify that you are not passing on any additional information to your servers by looking at your js code.</p>
<p>Your second javascript function requires a private key that is entered by the user and stored client-side (i.e. a cookie) &#8212; something that is never passed to your server. When you display data, before you output any keywords or text, you call the decrypt function with the user&#8217;s private key.</p>
<p>e.g. &#8220;document.write(decrypt(&#8217;kjfvclaylsery&#8217;,$cookie_private_key));&#8221;</p>
<p>Your database can number-crunch just as it did before &#8212; it&#8217;s only on the HTML output that you need to add the  decrypt javascript functions too. It shouldn&#8217;t even take long to implement.</p>
<p>If you need more clarification, feel free to send me an email on this (email in comment form).</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8084</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 23:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8084</guid>
		<description>Wes,
As far as I understand a self-hosted version would have open source interpreted by the server? I am proposing to compile it into an executable stand-alone version (closed source code).
Tim.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes,<br />
As far as I understand a self-hosted version would have open source interpreted by the server? I am proposing to compile it into an executable stand-alone version (closed source code).<br />
Tim.</p>
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		<title>By: Wes Mahler</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8080</link>
		<dc:creator>Wes Mahler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 12:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8080</guid>
		<description>@ Derick
Hey Derick thanks for the compliments, which is an interesting idea on the key.  Hm I’m trying to think, how much extra overhead that would cause because then every piece of data is encrypted so going in it has to be encrypted and coming out encrypted with a special key.  Yeah I see what you mean, it would basically insure what loss of data if a potential hacker, broke into the database and stole all the information which is a good concern you bring up.  We are working on SSLs, HackerSafe, and the datacenter we are moving into has 24/7 security and is a world class facility, I’ll take some pictures of it.  As of right now the main data that is encrypted is the users password, in an irreversible way so someone can’t harvest passwords later on and decrypt to get the actual passwords.  But I do like your idea, I can’t promise anything honestly I think it would be a lot of overhead so I’m not sure if we would be able to do it.  Early on we had some scalability problems, we redirect and analyze for the t202 users about 10-20,000 clicks a day already and analyzing it can sometimes can a long time already for heavy usage users sometimes, so encrypting everything might make sacrifice to much security for performance? I guess just have to weigh the options, I’m going to throw this by Rob our system admin to see what his thoughts are on it.  Also I got your AIM now I’ll shoot you an IM tomorrow if you around!

@ Dr. Nick
Just to clarify, are you mentioning something like Derick’s idea, and each user would have a specific “encryption key” that encrypts and decrypts a user’s data? I’m not sure I understand exactly what you mean yet, am I on the right path?

@ Zin
Hey Zin, absolutely if you are planning on developing more tools for the industry I’d love to network and bounce off ideas, we have some more products that we like to launch and would be happy to network with another developer in the AM realm!  My AIM is T202Wes if you want to contact me directly, would love to network.

@ Tim
Hey Tim, I actually like your idea that makes the most sense of what I’ve read so far, that it will be cracked, and then I guess the way is just to keep coming out with new updates so it will throw off the crackers (or just make it so everyone keeps upgrading), I think your on to something, that would probably be the only way to do it (depending on how fast I can come up and develop new features tho, lol, sometimes a feature can take me several weeks to just get it right.) But your model you mentioned I think would, that is the best way to potentially do it a self-hosted.  We’re still not sure if were going to do the self-hosted, and honestly it would be 6 months to a year out but I think I’d be safe to say we’d run with your suggestion on releasing updates on a frequent level to make it inconvenient to really want to hack new version every time.  Lol@ the UberAffliate comment on the commissions

----

Hey thanks everyone for the comments and suggestions, they have all been takin heed, we are talking about a self-hosted but it is 50/50 between the other people I work with and everyone in unsure, I think it is obvious now that this is what the market is interested in, I think we will be thinking about this one for a long time, because it is going to have some dramatic long-term effects, both negative and positive in certain aspects.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Derick<br />
Hey Derick thanks for the compliments, which is an interesting idea on the key.  Hm I’m trying to think, how much extra overhead that would cause because then every piece of data is encrypted so going in it has to be encrypted and coming out encrypted with a special key.  Yeah I see what you mean, it would basically insure what loss of data if a potential hacker, broke into the database and stole all the information which is a good concern you bring up.  We are working on SSLs, HackerSafe, and the datacenter we are moving into has 24/7 security and is a world class facility, I’ll take some pictures of it.  As of right now the main data that is encrypted is the users password, in an irreversible way so someone can’t harvest passwords later on and decrypt to get the actual passwords.  But I do like your idea, I can’t promise anything honestly I think it would be a lot of overhead so I’m not sure if we would be able to do it.  Early on we had some scalability problems, we redirect and analyze for the t202 users about 10-20,000 clicks a day already and analyzing it can sometimes can a long time already for heavy usage users sometimes, so encrypting everything might make sacrifice to much security for performance? I guess just have to weigh the options, I’m going to throw this by Rob our system admin to see what his thoughts are on it.  Also I got your AIM now I’ll shoot you an IM tomorrow if you around!</p>
<p>@ Dr. Nick<br />
Just to clarify, are you mentioning something like Derick’s idea, and each user would have a specific “encryption key” that encrypts and decrypts a user’s data? I’m not sure I understand exactly what you mean yet, am I on the right path?</p>
<p>@ Zin<br />
Hey Zin, absolutely if you are planning on developing more tools for the industry I’d love to network and bounce off ideas, we have some more products that we like to launch and would be happy to network with another developer in the AM realm!  My AIM is T202Wes if you want to contact me directly, would love to network.</p>
<p>@ Tim<br />
Hey Tim, I actually like your idea that makes the most sense of what I’ve read so far, that it will be cracked, and then I guess the way is just to keep coming out with new updates so it will throw off the crackers (or just make it so everyone keeps upgrading), I think your on to something, that would probably be the only way to do it (depending on how fast I can come up and develop new features tho, lol, sometimes a feature can take me several weeks to just get it right.) But your model you mentioned I think would, that is the best way to potentially do it a self-hosted.  We’re still not sure if were going to do the self-hosted, and honestly it would be 6 months to a year out but I think I’d be safe to say we’d run with your suggestion on releasing updates on a frequent level to make it inconvenient to really want to hack new version every time.  Lol@ the UberAffliate comment on the commissions</p>
<p>&#8212;-</p>
<p>Hey thanks everyone for the comments and suggestions, they have all been takin heed, we are talking about a self-hosted but it is 50/50 between the other people I work with and everyone in unsure, I think it is obvious now that this is what the market is interested in, I think we will be thinking about this one for a long time, because it is going to have some dramatic long-term effects, both negative and positive in certain aspects.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8076</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Feb 2008 20:06:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8076</guid>
		<description>Wes, here are some more thoughts on the stand-alone (executable) version:
First of all you may release it with some fancy security (dongle etc.) that will delay the cracking of it for a while. You may even use that as one of your selling points.
You are right that there is no sure-fire solution, but if you release frequent worthwhile updates that will create a huge pain in the *** for someone with a cracked version. They will need to wait weeks for a new crack every time! There are some &quot;dynamic cracks&quot;, but they aren&#039;t really effective.
I am gonna say something similar what Uberaffiliate said, if you release the executable version, then give me a cut ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes, here are some more thoughts on the stand-alone (executable) version:<br />
First of all you may release it with some fancy security (dongle etc.) that will delay the cracking of it for a while. You may even use that as one of your selling points.<br />
You are right that there is no sure-fire solution, but if you release frequent worthwhile updates that will create a huge pain in the *** for someone with a cracked version. They will need to wait weeks for a new crack every time! There are some &#8220;dynamic cracks&#8221;, but they aren&#8217;t really effective.<br />
I am gonna say something similar what Uberaffiliate said, if you release the executable version, then give me a cut <img src='http://www.wesmahler.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Zin</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8075</link>
		<dc:creator>Zin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Feb 2008 20:02:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8075</guid>
		<description>Wes,

I like your beliefs. I am also a programmer-affiliate marketer. I code in Ruby/Rails and attend Ruby events in London. Very much like yourself with PHP.

My aim is to learn to code as well as I can in order to build reliable affiliate marketing web apps for myself. I also want to release related Ruby plugins and foster an Open Source Affiliate Marketing community. Perhaps we can share code/designs in the future.

I&#039;m going to check out Tracking 202 now. Thank you for making this freely available.

Zin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes,</p>
<p>I like your beliefs. I am also a programmer-affiliate marketer. I code in Ruby/Rails and attend Ruby events in London. Very much like yourself with PHP.</p>
<p>My aim is to learn to code as well as I can in order to build reliable affiliate marketing web apps for myself. I also want to release related Ruby plugins and foster an Open Source Affiliate Marketing community. Perhaps we can share code/designs in the future.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m going to check out Tracking 202 now. Thank you for making this freely available.</p>
<p>Zin</p>
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		<title>By: Dr Nick</title>
		<link>http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/comment-page-1/#comment-8074</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Feb 2008 19:45:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wesmahler.com/why-is-tracking202-free-my-mistakes-launching-under-fire/#comment-8074</guid>
		<description>Use client-side encryption and decryption in javascript. There&#039;s a way you can do it so that even you won&#039;t be able to decrypt your own database (all your keywords would be garbled) but on the client-side it will decrypt into the proper keywords.

It requires a bit more setup on the user side, but it will at least provide them with a way of securing their own data themselves, plus you could prove that you do not have access to any meaningful data.

The beauty of it is that you would not need to change anything to your database calls, but you will need to develop some cookie-based javascript code for storing some algorithms &amp; passwords defined by the user.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Use client-side encryption and decryption in javascript. There&#8217;s a way you can do it so that even you won&#8217;t be able to decrypt your own database (all your keywords would be garbled) but on the client-side it will decrypt into the proper keywords.</p>
<p>It requires a bit more setup on the user side, but it will at least provide them with a way of securing their own data themselves, plus you could prove that you do not have access to any meaningful data.</p>
<p>The beauty of it is that you would not need to change anything to your database calls, but you will need to develop some cookie-based javascript code for storing some algorithms &amp; passwords defined by the user.</p>
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